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Was the Treaty of Versailles a Fair Document ? [Copy link] 中文

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Post time 2010-7-1 18:50:57 |Display all floors
The regions later called Sudetenland were situated on the borders of the Kingdom of Bohemia, which also consisted of Moravia and other lands (Silesia, Lusatia, etc.). After the extinction of the Přemyslid dynasty, the kingdom was ruled by the Luxemburgs, later the Jagiellonians and finally the Habsburgs. Already from the second half of the 13th century onwards the border regions of Czech lands, called Sudetenland in the 20th century, were settled by ethnic Germans, who were invited by the Bohemian kings – especially by Ottokar II and Wenceslaus II. The border was set by the signing of the Peace of Eger in 1459.


INVITED
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Post time 2010-7-1 18:52:08 |Display all floors
Originally posted by Alex2010 at 2010-7-1 18:46



One long answer in the filter.......the slavs arrived there after the Bavarians who left westwards.....this debate will find no end talking about who was there first....probably some Neandert ...


You can't deny WHEN the slavs were there - there is too much evidence that points to the 6th century.  And read the history of sudenten.  It has already been settled - they were inivited there to 'settle' and develop the bohemian crown.  That came later.  They were not there before the slavs.

wtf?  Is that what they teach in german history classes?  It was all german?

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Post time 2010-7-1 18:52:09 |Display all floors
Originally posted by JFenix at 2010-7-1 18:49
It was the celtic boii that lived in the region before the slavs arrived.  Hence the name 'bohemia' deriving from the boii.



Ancient Bohemia

Roman authors provide the first clear reference to this area as Boiohaemum, from Germanic Boi-Heim, "home of the Boii", a Celtic people. As part of the territory often crossed during the Migration Period by major Germanic and Slavic tribes, the western half was conquered and settled from the 1st century BC by Germanic (probably Suebic) peoples including the Marcomanni; the elite of some Boii then migrated west to modern Switzerland and southeastern Gaul. Those Boii that remained in the eastern part were eventually absorbed by the Marcomanni. Part of the Marcomanni, renamed the Bavarians (Baiuvarum), later migrated to the southwest. Although the leading tribes changed, there was a large degree of continuity in the actual population, and at no time was there a wholesale depopulation or change in ethnic stock.
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Post time 2010-7-1 18:54:27 |Display all floors
After the Bavarian emigration, Bohemia was partially repopulated around the sixth century by the Slavic precursors of today's Czechs, though the exact amount of Slavic immigration is a subject of debate. The Slavic influx was divided into two or three waves. The first wave came from the southeast and east, when the Germanic Langobards left Bohemia (circa 568 AD). Later immigrants came from the Black Sea region, as shown by Iranian place names as "Dudleb" (today in Prachens region, South Bohemia) and "Charvat" (Choroathos). Soon after, from the 630s to 660s, the territory was taken by Samo's tribal confederation. His death marked the end of the old "Slavonic" confederation, the second attempt to establish such a Slavonic union after Carantania in Carinthia.
Patria est ubicunque bene/Obsequium amicos, veritas odium parit

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Post time 2010-7-1 18:55:31 |Display all floors

from wiki

The regions later called Sudetenland were situated on the borders of the Kingdom of Bohemia, which also consisted of Moravia and other lands (Silesia, Lusatia, etc.). After the extinction of the Přemyslid dynasty, the kingdom was ruled by the Luxemburgs, later the Jagiellonians and finally the Habsburgs. Already from the second half of the 13th century onwards the border regions of Czech lands, called Sudetenland in the 20th century, were settled by ethnic Germans, who were invited by the Bohemian kings – especially by Ottokar II and Wenceslaus II. The border was set by the signing of the Peace of Eger in 1459.

From 1620 (loss of the Bohemian Revolt) onwards the Habsburgs gradually integrated the Kingdom of Bohemia into their monarchy, and it remained a part of that realm until its dismemberment after World War I. Conflicts between Czech and German nationalists emerged in the 19th century, for instance in the Revolutions of 1848 in the Habsburg areas: while the German-speaking population wanted to participate in the building of a German nation state, the Czech-speaking population insisted on keeping Bohemia out of such plans.

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Post time 2010-7-1 18:57:45 |Display all floors
Originally posted by Alex2010 at 2010-7-1 18:54
After the Bavarian emigration, Bohemia was partially repopulated around the sixth century by the Slavic precursors of today's Czechs, though the exact amount of Slavic immigration is a subject of d ...


Right - but the sudenten germans were not part of the boii.  So.....what's your point?

Better question - what about the sorbs?  They were a part of great moravia.

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Post time 2010-7-1 19:06:40 |Display all floors
Originally posted by JFenix at 2010-7-1 18:57


Right - but the sudenten germans were not part of the boii.  So.....what's your point?

Better question - what about the sorbs?  They were a part of great moravia.



My point is...that history is a little bit more complicated than your black and white understanding. "The slaves were first and then.....". Over 1000 years the different ethnic groups lived there together peacefully until the upcoming "new" nationalism destroyed that.

The Sorbs.....arrived 6th century and although they were conquered by Franconians......1200 years later they still exist, speaking their language etc......what does this tell you about the evil Germans and their Germanisation/Colonialization. The sorbs were 1200 years under German rule,yet not extinguished. Europe saw so many migrations waves during the last 2000 years....whole provinces devastated by the black death, new settlers arrived etc. This whole idea....ethnic "pure" nations is a rather new one.
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