Author: Morgezuma

U.S. Declares Cyber-War [Copy link] 中文

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Post time 2010-1-23 04:07:27 |Display all floors
To add, no one believe that our freedoms of speech, assembly, etc are ABSOLUTE.  There are limits, you cannot openly threaten the presidents life (or anyones for that matter), you cant incite people to do physical harm on others.  Like most things in life, it isnt black and whtie, its a grey scale.  But I've seen some pretty messed up stuff protected under free speech...such as protesters assembled at a gay soldiers funeral with GOD HATES FAGS and GOING STRAIGHT TO HELL signs.  And these people were protected under rights of speech and assembly.  But because there are limits does not make them "imaginary or ineffective"
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Post time 2010-1-23 04:22:45 |Display all floors
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Post time 2010-1-23 06:21:18 |Display all floors
I can tell where this conversation is going, and it will come down to whether you believe people have intrinsic rights (god has nothing to do with it), or if they are subject to whatever the rights their government chooses to give them.  I can tell you as an American, the latter is a very foreign concept.  The idea that government, in and of itself, is the sole authority on what rights it chooses to grant you is anathema to everything I learned growing up.  From my viewpoint, government only exists because the people choose to let it exist, not the other way around.  Perhaps this is a uniquely American concept?  We fought a rather bloody war to prove that point, and if it ever gets that bad again, there will be another war to prove the same point again.  Government is derived from the power of the people.  It only exists solely from the powers we grant it, not the other way around.  If it strays from that path, we are within our rights to dispose of it and create another.
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Post time 2010-1-23 09:36:41 |Display all floors
Originally posted by Baiquen at 2010-1-23 04:22
Yet if you took that famous quote to heart and attempted to depose your government what would happen to you? They wont look at that quote and say "aww, you got us, come and try again next year ...


You have to take into context the reason for rights and freedoms in the United States. They were devised during a time when a monarchy, whom was across the ocean, dictated the rights of the people. That is why there are certain clauses in the constitution to allow for the removal of a government. Can something like that happen in the United States today? It's unlikely, but possible. Yes you can't just take a gun and start shooting people to change the government by yourself, as you'll be arrested. But if you have enough support for a takeover, you can theoretically do it. Also, if you, for some reason, started a party here calling for the replacement of the United States government with another (dictatorship?) and garnered enough votes, you would be able to do so. Again, unlikely, but theoretically possible. There's been times when these rights were harmed (McCarthyism, for example), but no system is perfect.

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Post time 2010-1-23 12:20:16 |Display all floors
Also, if you, for some reason, started a party here calling for the replacement of the United States government with another


You'd be dealt with. The FBI would be so deep in your organization it would probably be one of their own men that was finally elected to be the new president if any new party was allowed to exist. And I warn you not to call it the "communist party", because that's simply a declaration of war against our kings. They might even put you down. We sent death squads killing whole families all around Nicaragua when they majority of people there elected a communist government. A lot of our "knight in shining armor" image is, well, just image.

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Post time 2010-1-23 12:23:01 |Display all floors

Someone wants a Cyber War With USofA?

Who's the bookie on that one.
Let the dice fly high

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Post time 2010-1-23 12:28:17 |Display all floors
Originally posted by sono_hito at 2010-1-23 06:21
From my viewpoint, government only exists because the people choose to let it exist, not the other way around.


Your view is noble indeed. However, it is we who serve the government. We are owned by the government. In the distant past, just after the US was formed, maybe for a time you could argue that the Govt was own by, and existed to serve the people. If that was ever true, it changed.

We don't have a govt by the people. I don't rule, you don't rule. So then, who does? Whatever the answer, simple or complicated, the fact is, someone is in control and it's not us.

Slogans about freedom and democracy are used to justify crimes against humanity. Only American's believe the spin. The rest of the world can clearly see who the hyper-aggressive imperialist is.

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