Author: thepeop

One China, indivisible [Copy link] 中文

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Post time 2008-7-14 09:07:43 |Display all floors
That's the point I'm trying to make... Mongolia was at least as much a part of China as other 'minority areas'.  And yet, while there is strong, impassioned rhetoric about how those areas will never be separated, Mongolia is barely mentioned.. is this realpolitik triumphing over ideals?

In some ways, what happened to Mongolia is exactly what is feared would have happened/will happen to T B- formal 'in- dep- endence' which in reality was sponsored by and in the interests of another great power (Russia).

So.. sub-question- is this a 'non-issue' because the PRC government has recognised Mongolia's status?  If so, would that apply to other areas-  is it government decisions, rather than the often-cited historical connections, cultural links, 'ties of blood' or whatever else, that determine whether somewhere is or should be part of China?

Other potentially relelvant areas- at least some parts of Vietnam (which have been under Chinese rule in the past, though not I think in the Qing), and the two parts of land given to Russia at the birth of the PRC (forgotten what they're called- in the north and obviously not nearly as big as Mongolia).

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Post time 2008-7-14 09:16:30 |Display all floors

It's just the name.

Originally posted by exportedkiwi at 2008-7-14 08:16
Mongolia is Mongolia. It was never part of China and, indeed, the Mongols under the Khans conquered China way back, so how can it be said that Mongolia is part of China....the mind boggles! Someone ...


Use some logic Kiwi.

Think of the combined territories of England, N.Ireland, Scotland and Wales. It is called Britain or the United Kingdom.  It is not called ''England'' (unless you want to start a fight) even though England is top dog.

For England substitute China. For Wales substitute Tibet. For N.Ireland substitute Tiawan. For Scotland substitute Mongolia.

All China needs is a name to describe her combined territory and keep pedantic people happy.

In the meantime, Mongolia is part of ''Great China'' .
(mostly harmless)

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Post time 2008-7-14 09:30:54 |Display all floors
Originally posted by thepeop at 2008-7-14 10:07
That's the point I'm trying to make... Mongolia was at least as much a part of China as other 'minority areas'.  And yet, while there is strong, impassioned rhetoric about how those areas will neve ...



That's the point I'm trying to make... Mongolia was at least as much a part of China as other 'minority areas'.  And yet, while there is strong, impassioned rhetoric about how those areas will never be separated, Mongolia is barely mentioned.. is this realpolitik triumphing over ideals?

You call it 'Realpolitik' and this certainly is part of it. What is more important is the fact that both, the KMT government and the government of the PRC officially acknowledged the independence of Mongolia. Jur. this acknowledgement constitutes binding 'public intl. law'.
Just think about HKG. In spite of the British Chinese treaty to cede HKG being forced upon the Qing emperor, this contract was fulfilled and HKG was given back to China in 1997. Afaik, China always fulfilled intl. contracts. Therefore once again, Mongolia to be part of China is a non subject.

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Post time 2008-7-14 09:42:12 |Display all floors
Oh yes, it's certainly not an issue for government policy.. but what about for the people?  I'd like to ask the supporters of Chinese unity what their own opinion is....

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Post time 2008-7-14 10:01:27 |Display all floors
Oh, and Mengzhi, cheers for the history lesson, the depth of your knowledge and understanding leaves me, as ever, in awe.  Now, how would you feel about answering the original question?

Actually, I might even be able to help you on your history!  Mongolia only became 'in- dep-endent' in much the same way as T B in 1911- de facto loss of direct Chinese government.  1924 has a better claim to mark in- dep- endence since it was then that the People's Republic of Mongolia was formally declared.  I hope you have learned something.

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Post time 2008-7-14 14:53:49 |Display all floors

What do they teach you in the UK ?

thepeop ,

Are you one of the " unteachables " ? I repeat : Mongolia left the bosom of mother China in 1911 , when the Qin dynasty was corrupt and moribund . The present government took office in 1949 , a cool 38 years after the event . Can't you count ?  Tbt was brutalized by a Col Younghusband from the vile isle of the colonialists in 1903 , did you know that ?  Massacres and trickery abound , and no come back for those brutal atrocities .  The dumbed downs are becoming an epidemic on this forum .

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Post time 2008-7-14 15:35:50 |Display all floors
Originally posted by thepeop at 2008-7-13 23:11
China, its borders defined by its size at the end of the Qing dynasty, is a unified nation whose parts are, were and always will be part of China.  No breaking away can be tolerated, because its la ...


May Mongolian  want  to return back.

[ Last edited by richardpap at 2008-7-14 03:36 PM ]

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