Author: northwest

Democracy manipulator, color revolutions and CIA arms [Copy link] 中文

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Post time 2006-10-19 12:30:42 |Display all floors
Are you implying that not all of the Chinese are intelligent enough to make a good choice?  


Actually, James Woolsey and his kind continously spread lies and bad faiths in Chinese soils. If we manage to give him a bullet at the back of the head, we may develop our form of democracy with much relieve.

Or perhaps you are fearful that they will be able to discern the truth and actually make the correct choice?


You are talking about Iraqis WMD? or the truth about Enron?

Those denying others a voice in determining their own future are usually the group currently in charge who do not wish to lose their current power base and the resulting perks or wealth that accompanies their position.


Yes, Halliburton, Enron and Exxon... corporates centered around US establishment. Just watched it when that cowboy stole the election in Florida. So much for gentleman's fair game.

The welfare and benefits to the common people/citizens are the least of their concerns.


Yeah, they are not concerned about history-high US budget deficit, as long as Halliburton get the job in Afghanistan and Iraq.
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Post time 2006-10-19 14:48:20 |Display all floors
joe wrote, "yes, when it comes to matter of national, or international, importance.  for example, 90% of chinese want to revenge japan.  85% want to take taiwan today.
75% want to go back to communism of materials.  a majority would want to get rid of the 1-child policy.  now, can u see what a incredible balance act the present chinese leaders are performing."

That is very interesting.
You've given me something to think about, thank you.

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Post time 2006-10-19 15:41:22 |Display all floors
Originally posted by joeching at 2006-10-19 12:27
everything u said is very reasonable, except for the fact that u r talking about a predatory society that the non-westernized chinese are not very familiar with and would wanted to repel if they realized the sacrifice they have to make, such as harmony and desfunctioning family structures.


Predatory society? Then why are thousands and thousands of Chinese and other Asian people trying to come here each year?
The ethnic Chinese Australians are known for their strong family and society bonds and seem to be able to maintain those bonds when they live here. They appear quite able to practice their customs in Australia. There's a Chinese traditional medicine outlet in my local shopping strip, and many of my neighbours have Feng Shue(?)  symbols on their outside walls. I even saw one older lady lighting up her incense sticks at a small outdoor (ancestor?) shrine.
Predatory society, I don't think so.


Originally posted by joeching at 2006-10-19 12:27
actually, all we are talking about is getting good people to lead and serve the country.  why do we let the mass decide, rather than the people with greatest integrity, knowledgeable and qualification.  china has long established such a system.  


These people with the greatest integrity, are you talking about the fellow in charge of the Shanghai pension fund, the senior official from the PLA Navy or the local city officials who own illegal coal mines?

I am not suggesting that every government official or CCP member is corrupt, just that a system of absolute power makes it difficult to remove these people before a lot of damage is done.

With popularly elected officials, the smallest whiff of corruption is likely to damage the re-election prospects. This encourages more scrupulous behaviour by elected representatives.

Originally posted by joeching at 2006-10-19 12:50
yes, when it comes to matter of national, or international, importance.  for example, 90% of chinese want to revenge japan.  85% want to take taiwan today.
75% want to go back to communism of materials.  a majority would want to get rid of the 1-child policy.  now, can u see what a incredible balance act the present chinese leaders are performing.


Joe, the attitudes of the people is affected by the media. If they're getting an exaggerated story or false information they may over react compared to the reality.
If the people are given balanced information then I think you will find they are more reasonable.


JB
"他不是救星, 他是一个非常淘气男孩" - Monty Python

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Post time 2006-10-19 16:24:04 |Display all floors

since this nasty question has been

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Post time 2006-10-19 18:29:26 |Display all floors
Originally posted by chinese_yang at 2006-10-19 18:24
since this nasty question has been repeatedly appeared on CD numerous times, let me answer you with the following:

1.History proved that Chinese lawfully stepped on the soil of that continent and shared the peaceful cultivation and development through hard working with the natives earlier than you did. It was you later comers who criminally resorted to the crimes of genocide, looting the resources, self-claiming the owner of the land and other types of violence;

Zheng He's fleet (to which you presumably refer) was said to have visited Australia. The Chinese fleets also visited many other countries and demanded "tribute" from the local people.


Originally posted by chinese_yang at 2006-10-19 18:24
2.International Convention on Civil and Political Rights, Article 12 – 2 Every one shall be free to leave any country, including his own.
Your left your own country by violent forces, why Chinese can’t do by lawful means? Where in the law says that the move of the Chinese should be used as the traffic of your imperial enslavement?


Yang, I agree with this Convention on Civil and Political rights. Australians are free to leave the country. And I believe Chinese people are now relatively free to travel too. North Koreans, however, are not so well treated when they escape into China.
Now the right to leave the country does not equate with a right to enter any other country without regard to the immigration policy of that country.

Originally posted by chinese_yang at 2006-10-19 18:24
3.Democracy is the common pursuit of mankind. Have you declared democracy to the entire world, having invited their confidence to lead them to have believed that they are entitled to protection under the rules of international law applicable in armed conflict?


Um yeah.





JB
"他不是救星, 他是一个非常淘气男孩" - Monty Python

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Post time 2006-10-19 19:07:38 |Display all floors

yeah what, emu

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Post time 2006-10-20 00:36:52 |Display all floors

Reply #12 & 13 --- joeching's posts...

Your quote,

why do we let the mass decide, rather than the people with greatest integrity, knowledgeable and qualification.  china has long established such a system. the communists have even remove the security-blanket type of figure head, the emperor, from the top.  u democratists should learn from it, rather than continue suffer under the manipulation of the politicians.


Who gets to decide which people have the greatest integrity, knowledge and qualifications?  And what if there is disagreement of who gets selected, or even what the selected people do?  How can you guarantee that Communist leaders will not continue to manipulate their people?  I belive most peole oppose such tyranny.

yes, when it comes to matter of national, or international, importance.  for example, 90% of chinese want to revenge japan.  85% want to take taiwan today.


First, where are you pulling these percentages from?  Please provide background source/evidence for your numbers.  Secondly, even if these were true figures, don't you believe that the government of the people should try follow the wishes of the people with respect to bettering their lives?  You used extreme examples, and should take into account that any major war would involve great loss of life and destruction on both sides.

joeching & northwest:

Your other points shifted the topic from your belief that Chinese people are not intelligent to make their own decisions to saying American, Israeli, etc citizens are too dumb to make good choices for their own country.  Please stick to the original question.  Who are you to judge what actions/national policy of other people believe are best for them?  

If Chinese leaders are doing a good job for the people, then they should not fear being replaced in a democatic election.  And such an election is the only true way to determine if the people believe their leaders are supporting policies which help them.

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