Author: english-learner

How is China's wealth distributed?   [Copy link] 中文

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Post time 2014-7-29 07:11:26 |Display all floors
This post was edited by ztoa789 at 2014-7-29 07:21
roninxian Post time: 2014-7-29 00:16
I am so happy I took a class in college called "Lying with Statistics".  It pointed out how simple s ...

Whethere a system is capitalism or socialism depends on how much capital is under government's control.

In China, most dominating economic sectors, like banking, natural resources, military are under government's control, Therefore China is a socialist country no matter how China looks like a capitalist country in shopping malls.

US, on the other hand, is still a capitalist country even government hires 50% of working force, because banks and natural resources are privately owned.

So under socialism, people are entitled to wealth generated by huge pool of capital. but there is risk: the capital belongs to people, but people don't have direct control of the capital, just like putting your money in a mutual fund, you take the risk of losing all the money. Under capitalism,
people are not even entitled to the wealth generated from capital, because they don't have the right to fight for the vast amount of wealth, they have more freedom to do anything else, under the guidance of media owned by the super rich.

In countries with lot of poor people, capitalism is not the way to help poor people, though fair on paper. It is simple math, lot of poor people need lot of wealth to help them (teach them fishing, not give them a fish), therefore, you can't allow few capitalists to control capital and economy for their own best interests if you try to help the poor.
To help the poor, capital must work for people, therefore socialism is the ONLY POSSIBLE way, because poor people are entitled to the wealth generated by capital.

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Post time 2014-7-29 07:12:12 |Display all floors
seneca Post time: 2014-7-28 22:51
You made two nonsensical statements in your pst:

"Chinese people - no matter how poor or rich!  ...

LOL,

Calm down, Calm down, Seneca.

Chinese people are the owners of SOE. and enjoys the profits from them

Where do you think Chinese government gets money for infrastructure? do you have any clue how much a kilometer of highway cost?

Without the capital, how on earth would Chinese companies be able to compete against powerful west companies on natural resouces?

What? you think Chinese government is crowded with genius who can generate money out of thin air?

About West,  what is the symbol of middle class ? owning an apartment.

As those who don't own an apartment, there are job opportunites with which they can enjoy good lives. That is direct related to the industrial level and population.. Let the population in any West country be tripled, what would the situation like?

Big mouth journalists blah blah like it is so easy to create job opportunities. You think there are 2 million good job opportunities in a region of 7 million (Hong Kong), then government should be able to create 6 million good job opportunities with 21 million people?

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Post time 2014-7-29 07:12:54 |Display all floors
This post was edited by ztoa789 at 2014-7-29 07:15
elzach Post time: 2014-7-28 19:16
Good topic English Learner. Actually the wealth gap is worse than the figures you used. I read on Ca ...

Ya, top 5% own 90% of the 1.3 trillion dollars.

Economists complained that in China, the most profitable economic sectors are all under government's government controls, those profits are money AFTER corruption, where does the money go?

Here is an example : In USA, top 6 oil companies make 150 billion dollars of profits each year, and government still has to subside 4 billion dollar to oil companies each year.

So let us say ALL the oil companies make about 240 billion dollars of profits each year,  with SP500 return of 8%, that is 3 trillion dollars of capital.  Who are the owners of this capital in USA, few super rich, Who are the owners of the correspondent capital in China? 1.35 billion people!!

Whoever produced  numbers you used are either ignorant or purposely ignore  the situation in China.

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Post time 2014-7-29 07:14:49 |Display all floors
robert237 Post time: 2014-7-28 09:37
Your third point is often overlooked.
""Three, though not in people pocket, people are  ...

Thanks, Longzhou,


1) 150 million people live in areas of difficult access but IMO it is and has to be the duty of the government to care for their basic needs at least; access to water, land that can produce a benefit and schooling for their children.


It is government's job, I agree. My point is that it doesn't mean government CAN create so many job opportunities with so many people. If the population in Hong Kong or Singapore had been tripled, both of them will have millions of poor people. Even now in Hong Kong, there are tens of thousands living in dog cages.

2) I agree completely. Give a man a fish he will eat one day; teach him how to fish and he will source of food his family his whole life.

That is one of the master pieces by "free" media :  convincing public to treat government like a b1tch, the government has no choice but giving fishes, hence no long term planning by government. then big mouth "free" media points fingers at government like it is government's fault.

And corruption is what the present Government is fighting.

The corruption in "free" world is just hefty payment to the top executives. So what western fundamentalists suggest is just transferring the wealth and A LOT MORE to the newly 0.1%, doesn't mean a penny to the 99%

Wealth normally refers to Net Worth and this means the amount the assets exceed the liabilities. For example, if you current's house value is, let's say, 1,000,000 RMB and the outstanding balance of your mortgage is 500,000 RMB, your Net Worth Wealth (I am not considering other factors like, cars, investment portfolios, insurance policies, etc.) is 500,000 RMB.


I doubt the numbers in China is calculated like this, it needs far more works and information that are impossible to be done without government. Several professors simply don't have such information.

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Post time 2014-7-29 09:20:17 |Display all floors
seneca Post time: 2014-7-28 06:54
Your post is so hopeless I think you weretalking about the vagini effect where others were talki ...

Oh if only you would mean it when you say "farewell".
But we all know your hobby is twisting facts and ignoring the obvious.

What part of .47 is a much better gini index than .63 don't you understand?

If capitalism promotes innovation and creativity then why aren't scientists and artists the richest people in a capitalist nation?

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Post time 2014-7-29 19:24:44 |Display all floors
This post was edited by ztoa789 at 2014-7-29 19:31
seneca Post time: 2014-7-29 17:13
Your explanations concerning China's socialist ownership structure leave me baffled and I will s ...

Do You think that there are 2 million good job opportunities in a region of 7 million (Hong Kong), then government should be able to create 6 million good job opportunities with 21 million people?

If not, please tell us how US and West would be like if their populations was tripled.


What is so hard for you to understand?

With large population and lot of poor people, to help the poor, capital must work for people, not the super rich.



Therefore, Socialism is the ONLY POSSIBLE way, that is, let government manage capital on behalf of people, just like you put your money in mutual fund, and let mutual fund manage, so your wealth grows as economy grows.


So the risk is obvious, the mutual fund may lose all your money, and the managers may get unfair amount of bonus for themselves, like Wall st,


Any questions?



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Post time 2014-7-29 19:51:20 |Display all floors
Here is an example how SOE helped the poor.

Since Hu and Wen took over, the focus of economic development shifted to inner land and northwest part of China.

How did government do that? it used its controls of state own banks, gave favorite rate to the investments in poor area, to encourage investors to open factory etc in poor areas China.

Would this be possible if the banks are privately owned?


Just think of the 150 billion dollars of profits top US oil companies earn each year, US paid about 300 billion dollars of interests each year.

Imagine, most of those most profitable sectors are SOE,  would US have trouble to balance the budget.

Get a clue the price Westerners paid for their political rights?

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