Author: chairman

CHINGLISH.........? [Copy link] 中文

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Post time 2006-12-18 07:57:18 |Display all floors
Originally posted by cestmoi at 2006-12-17 17:32
In New Zealand, that would be "fish and chops".

Anyway, usage makes legal. "Give us an example", I hear you ask. Afro-American English.

Now here's a teaser, where do you think this bit of Australianism comes from: "Fair dinkum?" ...



Cestmoi,
I have to disagree with you (surprise-surprise) on the New Zealand variation.
It's commonly referred to as "Fush und Chups" here. But I don't think that even that is accurate.

New Zealand is referred to as Aotearoa, "The land of the long white cloud".
I think a more accurate term is "The land of the indeterminate vowell" and if one applied that rule, I think you get a fairly accurate representation.

"Fsh nd Chps"

Now South African english (as spoken by white South Africans from an Afrikaaner background) is another case.
In some cases simple vowell substitution makes a pretty good approximation.

Try saying "Sythe Ifrica" and you're pretty close

Back to your trivia question.
I know where you're coming from on that, as I read some time back of the term's mooted origin, and found it quite plausible, however today's quick search yielded another more mundane result.

http://www.abc.net.au/wordmap/rel_stories/talkback.htm
Another folktale with great currency at the moment is about the origin of "fair dinkum". It is supposed that "dinkum" is a Cantonese word meaning true gold and comes from the excited cry of Chinese on the goldfields when they struck it rich. The Europeans picked the word up in that linguistic cross-fertilisation that occurred when all manner of people were thrown together in the camaraderie of frontier life.

The origin of "dinkum" actually lies in British dialect, where it meant "a day's allocation of work". "Your dinkum" was what you were required to get done so, naturally. a fair dinkum was a matter of some importance. The phrase "fair dinkum" existed in the Lincolnshire dialect.


So unfortunately it appears that the phrase has a less intriguing history than otherwise might be the case.
Although, as I presume you are a native Cantonese speaker, that you may be able to provide some further information on whether there is a similar word in Cantonese which might fit the bill?

Cheers
JB
"他不是救星, 他是一个非常淘气男孩" - Monty Python

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Post time 2006-12-18 08:09:15 |Display all floors

Money Talks

In days past it was the Queen's English that supposedly show culture and refinement.  Then the Yanks became rich and powerful, and American English became the standard.  

When China's GDP is US$25,000 per head, whatever style of English the Chinese desire to adopt will be the mainstream.

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Post time 2006-12-18 08:44:26 |Display all floors
Originally posted by tongluren at 2006-12-18 10:09
In days past it was the Queen's English that supposedly show culture and refinement.  Then the Yanks became rich and powerful, and American English became the standard.

When China's GDP is US$25,000 per head, whatever style of English the Chinese desire to adopt will be the mainstream.


I don't think so.

A well spoken, universally understandable version of spoken English will be respected everywhere in the English speaking world, and should be intelligible even amongst the Chinglish/Engrish/Hinglish/Spanglish/Franglish speakers.

So a well spoken Bostonian's English should be as well understood as someone speaking RP (received pronunciation), although I do find RP a little "stiff".

Everyday speech of a Yorkshireman, can be difficult to understand if you're not from Yorkshire. Same can apply with Australian-English & American-English and other variations.
The key is in educating the users, that while Singlish (for example) might be all right to use at home in Singapore, it might not be in the best interests of easy communication in other parts of the world.

Popularity is another thing. Many non-native English speakers choose to learn to speak English with an American accent, and that's all well and good.
There are, however, relatively neutral alternatives which do not signify any particular regional accent and, when coupled with the speaker's original accent, could be equally at home in any part of the English speaking world.

Personally, I believe that TESOL teachers (in non-English speaking countries) should be careful to teach their students in an accent neutral way simply for purposes of clarity.
Anyone who, for example, taught their pupils to speak with a strong Australian accent and using Australian slang, would not be doing their students a proper service. Any particular slang or localised English words should be explained to the student so that they can be aware that parts of their speech may not be universally understood in the rest of the native English speaking world.

JB
"他不是救星, 他是一个非常淘气男孩" - Monty Python

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Post time 2006-12-18 09:12:00 |Display all floors
Freakyqi--my classmates and I, when in Beijing, called our speech "Englese." I don't really know if it's an accepted term, but I'm sure it's properly descriptive--Chinglish for what Chinese people hear us not-fluent-yet English speakers saying.

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Post time 2006-12-18 09:59:15 |Display all floors

how proud would you have to be

to not call it chinglish....

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chairman has been deleted
Post time 2006-12-18 13:22:19 |Display all floors

# 38 Emucentral

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Post time 2006-12-18 16:46:58 |Display all floors
I will show you some color to see

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